All About Light Sport Aircraft: July 2013

Wednesday, July 31, 2013

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point - update

I picked up my Student Pilot Certificate today, FAA form 8710-2. Now we are even more excited than before. The dream seems "real" now. Next week will be visiting the local club. Anybody here a member of the Foothills Flying Club, in Upland, CA?

-Alan

--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <abartz@...> wrote:
>
> Hello everyone. This is my starting point in my adventure towards LSA activity. I have reached the point in my life that either I start this interest now, or let it go. I choose to start!
>
> I know only what I have read in the WIKI sites regarding obtaining a LSA certificate. It seems doable for me. There is an airfield close by and will also be lurking around there to get an idea of how to proceed.
>
> The goal is to own and fly a piper type aircraft. I am very impressed by the Graphite Cub I found at CubCrafters. Most every review I have found liked them too.
>
> So here I am, ready to learn. Hit me with your best advise, or warnings. Hopefully I will be able to contribute something down the road.
>
> Thanks for having me here!
>
> Alan
> Southern California
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Jerry,

The 16 hour course is only good for ELSA, not SLSA.
The manufacture can only dictate who can do the work and what work can be done
for SLSA.

R. Williams

---------- Original Message -----------
From: "Jerry" <jself1@carolina.rr.com>
To: <Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Wed, 31 Jul 2013 11:25:51 -0400
Subject: RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

> "Anyone can do the work." I
> thought that this is only true
> for ESLA and not for SLSA
> where the manufacturer's
> manual indicates who can do
> any particular task....Jerry
> in NC
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
> [mailto:Sport_Aircraft@yahoogr
> oups.com] On Behalf Of James
> Meade
> Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2013
> 10:00 AM
> To:
> Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft
> Yahoo group Re: A starting
> point
>
> I think you want to say that
> the 16 hour course lets you
> sign off the condition
> inspection. Anyone can do the
> work.
>
> ------------------------------
> ------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/
> Sport_Aircraft/
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/
> Sport_Aircraft/join
> (Yahoo! ID required)
>
> Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogro
> ups.com
>
> Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@ya
> hoogroups.com
>
> Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yah
> oogroups.com
>
> http://docs.yahoo.com/info/ter
> ms/
------- End of Original Message -------

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

"Anyone can do the work." I
thought that this is only true
for ESLA and not for SLSA
where the manufacturer's
manual indicates who can do
any particular task....Jerry
in NC

-----Original Message-----
From:
Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
[mailto:Sport_Aircraft@yahoogr
oups.com] On Behalf Of James
Meade
Sent: Wednesday, July 31, 2013
10:00 AM
To:
Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft
Yahoo group Re: A starting
point

I think you want to say that
the 16 hour course lets you
sign off the condition
inspection. Anyone can do the
work.

------------------------------
------

Yahoo! Groups Links

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/
Sport_Aircraft/

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/
Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogro
ups.com

Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@ya
hoogroups.com

Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yah
oogroups.com

http://docs.yahoo.com/info/ter
ms/

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

I think you want to say that the 16 hour course lets you sign off the
condition inspection. Anyone can do the work.

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Hi All-I have been watching the discussions on this group for some time, and thank you for all the opinions and information. I am 65 years old, not able to fully retire because of the money thing. I have a 47 Stinson in my Shop, 108-1, 4 place, that I work on in my spare time. Also have a Heavy Tierra T-bird I built in the late 80's, and am lightening it up to become a true ultralight so I can fly it out of the farm. Also am in the long slow process of building a Mosquito ultralight helicopter, about 2/3 done, only holdup there is money for the parts. Soloed in 1970, in my first T-Craft. Flew it on a student ticket, then sold it and bought another T-Craft and flew it. Built the T-bird, and quit flying it when they started to get serious about the weight limits. Bought the Stinson, and flew it (Alone, on my student ticket) until a hurricane came through South Florida and a wall fell on one of my wings. Had the wings repaired at a shop there. Took her apart after lots of falderall and put her in the hanger at the farm here in North Florida, and work on repairing all the little things that hadn't been kept up over the years. About ready to repaint the wings, put the interior back in, and put the wings back on, then get everything signed off again. I was a crew chief/mechanic on Hueys in Vietnam for 2 tours, so learned to fly Helicopters there. My uncle was a CIA pilot and taught me to fly fixed wing when I was still in my teens. I keep up my physical, and take a hour here and there with a flight instructor in whatever they are using for a trainer, although it seems to be only about once a year. Built a helicopter and fixed wing simulator, and use Microsoft and X on both of them. Now live on a little farm in north central Florida, North of Tampa. I put a lot of thought in "what to do about the aircraft and should I or should I not get my private? I have taken and passed my written 3 times over the years, but life always got in the way of taking the check ride, and now it appears to be even harder. The written is only good for 2 years, and that goes by quickly. I would guess there are quite a few of us out here in similar situations to me. Our children never seemed to become completely self sufficient, and a lot of time we thought was going to be ours is not. The financial crisis didn't help. However, I still have hope, the only thing is staying healthy and living long enough! The reason I have not yet considered Sport Pilot seriously is the fact that I own a 4 place airplane, and there is no market out there to sell the Stinson and trade down to a T-Craft again, which I would love to do. GA is not taking off again very well yet, as we all hoped it would do. Was hoping the Homeland security thing would die down and go away, but it seems to be getting stronger, and seems to be targeting GA even more. The FAA has not been friendly to the EAA and Experimental crowd either, making less and less young people interested in aviation. It stays interesting, but doesn't seem to help me make a decision. Hope this finds you all well, and I wish you blue sky's!

Rolland Christians
christiansnaples@aol.com

__._,_.___

Your email settings: Individual Email|Traditional
Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required)
Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch to Fully Featured
Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe

__,_._,___

Tuesday, July 30, 2013

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

A Standard category aircraft cannot be converted to experimental except as an R&D or exhibition category, which are severely limited in their allowed operation. Some models of AC have had STC weight increases that take them out of the ability to be used as sport AC, they cannot be returned to their original certification. Erocoupes converted to D models is one example that comes to mind. An Experimental LS is the only AC you can take the 16 hour course on and get the certification to do all the work. For an Experimental AB you must be the builder who registered the AC to receive the non transferable repairman's certificate.

--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, Bob Comperini <bob@...> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > That said, I'm 99% sure you can later "convert" a standard category aircraft to reregister it as Experimental, if you want, so first have the advantages of not scaring off CFIs and later the advantages of the experimental registration.
> > (Someone here mentioned that he took, as I did, a 16 hour Light Sport Mechanic course, which allows us to do our own annual inspections.)
>
> That 16 hour course would not help someone who registers a standard category plane as an experimental. It also does not help someone else their experimental is certificated in the "operating as a light sport" experimental subcategory.
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group MAP

Hi. Anyone else running a 912UL with IFA prop? I'm confused about MAP settings - the book says 27.2 @ 5000rpm but I've read elsewhere that to avoid detonation you shouldn't use less than 5200 at that MAP setting. What should I use for 5000 then?
Allan

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Monday, July 29, 2013

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Sorry. I mistyped a word in a sentence. It should have read:

"It also does not help someone UNLESS their..."

Stupid auto correct.
-
Bob Comperini
http://www.fly-ul.com

On Jul 29, 2013, at 11:25 AM, Bob Comperini <bob@fly-ul.com> wrote:

>>
>>
>> That said, I'm 99% sure you can later "convert" a standard category aircraft to reregister it as Experimental, if you want, so first have the advantages of not scaring off CFIs and later the advantages of the experimental registration.
>> (Someone here mentioned that he took, as I did, a 16 hour Light Sport Mechanic course, which allows us to do our own annual inspections.)
>
> That 16 hour course would not help someone who registers a standard category plane as an experimental. It also does not help someone else their experimental is certificated in the "operating as a light sport" experimental subcategory.
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

>
>
> That said, I'm 99% sure you can later "convert" a standard category aircraft to reregister it as Experimental, if you want, so first have the advantages of not scaring off CFIs and later the advantages of the experimental registration.
> (Someone here mentioned that he took, as I did, a 16 hour Light Sport Mechanic course, which allows us to do our own annual inspections.)

That 16 hour course would not help someone who registers a standard category plane as an experimental. It also does not help someone else their experimental is certificated in the "operating as a light sport" experimental subcategory.

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Hi Herman,

First let me clear up a bit of confusion of names.
I addressed you (below) as "Alan". Apologies to you and Alan.
Second, You addressed me as "Alan". I'm Alex. ;-)

You are definitely not off your rocker to start at your age.
Recently I read an article about a sport pilot who flew on his hundredth birthday.
Some of us older guys (as I said, I started serious flight training at your age of 70) often have some real advantages over the kids. One is called "judgment"…. Which, _if_ we're not too pigheaded to have learned from experience, we do gain with age. You're probably retired, so you're less likely to get caught in the situation where between work, kids, and life it's too hard to schedule trainings at short enough intervals.

One of the things I love about flying , and even the very process of getting the license is it really perks up your brain in an multifaceted way.
It involves the psycho-physical skills of the actual flying (judging position, coordinating movements of stick and rudder, instantaneous reading and reacting to rate of sink, sight picture of the runway, etc, etc), the mental skills such as relating what's on a paper chart (or GPS screen) to what's outside the window of the plane, of translating quickly in your head what it means relative to you where you are, and your safety when you hear a radio call from another pilot saying "Piper Dakota Niner eight Foxtrox Lima, I'm 6 miles to the north east of Hyatt Lake at 4000 descending inbound for three zero", understanding when a slight change in engine sound, or an oil pressure reading, is meaningless and when it calls for attention, judging when a ridge might be creating downwind turbulence, etc, etc.
In short, the very things that are challenging about flying and getting the license are part what gives its its richness and is particularly great for keeping us oldsters brains and spirits young.

And of course as you already know from your previous flights the views of the world from the air at altitudes we fly are totally different than when on the ground or at 35,000 feet in an airliner..

A thought or two about the Aeronca Champ. Although it's "sport pilot legal" it's a standard category aircraft. That seriously limits who can work on it, who can do the sometimes-very-expensive annual inspections, etc. Also, it's tail wheel, which requires a bit more skill to learn, and since somewhat more prone to landing mishaps, all things being equal insurers (if you get hull insurance) charge more.
On the plus side, it's likely to be easier to find a CFI willing to train you in a standard category aircraft (which they're more familiar with) than if you show up, as I did, with a not terribly well known experimental (I and my co-owner have a Skyranger …. Much like a Kitfox, but less known.)
That said, I'm 99% sure you can later "convert" a standard category aircraft to reregister it as Experimental, if you want, so first have the advantages of not scaring off CFIs and later the advantages of the experimental registration.
(Someone here mentioned that he took, as I did, a 16 hour Light Sport Mechanic course, which allows us to do our own annual inspections.) If you reclassify to experimental you can never move it back to Standard.

This is a very good time to by BUYING a plane (a lousy time to sell one): In short, because of many factors, used aircraft prices are depressed. There are some real good deals out there.
If you mention the range of your budget, I bet folks here would chime in with some suggestions of models to consider. And, in case none of us already mentioned this: If you can find a good partner you're compatible with to jointly buy a plane with (I found a GREAT local partner by running an ad in Barnstormers) everything costs half as much.

Richard and you are correct. You don't need a student license to start training. All you need is a logbook (and a plane and a CFI and some cash <g>). You need the student license before you solo. You need proof of citizenship and ID to present to a CFI at some point. Many CFI's are unfamiliar with how to direct you to get a student license as a prospective sport pilot. That's because traditional applicants for regular private pilot license get their student pilot license issued by a medical examiner when they go get their first class-3 medical certificate.

You might check out EAA and AOPA to see if they can point you to instructors in your area who (a) are familiar with the whole sport pilot thing and (b) not averse to flying experimentals. EAA, or its nearest chapter, in particular might be likely to point you to CFIs OK with experimentals.
That said, I was the first sport pilot my CFI ever trained …. He just had to do a bit of study on the differences in what he had to, and did not have to, teach me.

As I mentioned there are many computerized disk based and web-based tutorials, widely varying in price.
It would be a whole separated long thread to get opinions on the pros and cons of each.
But they can be very helpful. I used one of Gliem's packages. It had some good features, but I'm neither especially recommending or panning it.

My personal opinion is that practicing flying on flight simulator software on a home computer is of very minor help in learning to fly. (I can see it could be helpful in learning and practicing instrument flying, but as a sport pilot you are not required to learn instrument navigation… and indeed can never get an instrument rating.)
That (instrument navigation) reminds me: Although in your training you'll be required to learn some traditional compass and map dead reckoning navigation (so go ahead and learn enough of it so you don`t have to blow-off all the test questions on that topic, or, as I did, waste your time crabbing at your CFI about having to learn it<g>), in reality in all probability you'll get a naircraft GPS (or install one in an iPad) and, despite the fact that it will say "never use this as your primary navigation instrument," in reality it will be your primary navigation instrument anytime you're out of your local familiar area. GPS has made flying radically easier and safer than thirty years ago.
Fortunately, the flight examiner who I look my final flight exam was realistic in that respect.
He did make sure I understood how to read and use the old paper charts and plan a flight on one, but was not as obsessed as some might be about you having to be able to plot and calculate an alternate on a paper chart while in the air.
He WAS concerned that whatever electronics/avionics, such as my GPS, that I DID have and use, that I really understood how to use them, and their limitations.

I know at your stage this is jumping way ahead, but regarding the to some students intimidating final flight test: Flight examiners are not out to fail students. They are constrained by some rules but basically want to know if you can fly safely, aren`t an airhead, and are unlikely to be a danger to yourself or other pilots.

Keep us posted on your progress, OK?

Alex

--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, Herman Funk <funk.herman@...> wrote:
>
> Hello Alan,
> Your post is indeed encouraging.Â I am turning 70 in a couple of months and have been wondering if I was off my rocker considering learning to fly as a Sport Pilot.Â You and your wife sound just like me and mine.Â With the limited time we have spent with friends in small planes I think Sport Pilot and LSA' are exactly what we would greatly enjoy.Â
>
> My big challenge is finding a CFI and plane to get training.Â I have been strongly considering purchasing something like a Aeronca Champ, if I could find one atÂ an affordable price and relatively close to where I live in NW Missouri.
>
> Thanks for the suggestions about taking it a step at a time, sort of like eating an elephant.Â Does one need a student license to start training for Sport Pilot?
>
> Herman
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: circicirci <acensor@...>
> To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 11:12 AM
> Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point
>
>
>
> Â
> Alan,
>
> Adding to, agreeing with, and echoing Ralph's "you're never to old" comment:
>
> Although I did briefly fly a hang glider in the 70's, and bummed a very few hours at the controls when I could beg a fight or pay for a sightseeing flight, I didin't start seriously into getting my license until age 70. Was flying solo before my 71st birth day an have been having a blast since. My wife loves to fly .
>
> Another note of a mental and training strategy that worked well for me, and might for others: to avoid getting overwhelmed or discouraged or procrastinate on "all these skills, tests, requirements" Was so to speak compartmentalised and bite the requirements off sort of one at a time. Kind of like this:
>
> First, get student license.
> Get some dual time and some comfort flying.
> Get to where CFI let's me land.
> Get signed off to solo.
>
> Practice/study knowledge test to point where I can consistently score not less than 80% on the computerized practice tests.
> Get my test software to generate its authorization for me to take FAA test certificate.
> Schedule an official FAA test.
>
> Get signed off for required cross counrty flight.and do it.
>
> Learn and prep for what to expect on final flight exam with DPE.
> Find out as much as practical about what tat particular flight examiner expects and does.
> Schedule final flight exam.
> Take and pass it.
> Make sure to get all useful endorsements from CFI.. Particularly controlled airspace endorsement.
>
> Scheduling test points, very useful. Knowing, for example, my knowledge test was in two weeks really got me disciplined about polishing my studying. Got 98% on the test. I don't kid myself that tha means "I have mastery of 98% of all weather, aeronautics,navigation, FAA rules,etc. " I had a bit of good luck in what questions popped up on my particular test session ... But I kew form my practice tests there was no way I could get less than 80% rock bottom.
> What a relief to have each step done.
>
> --- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph" <rstar447@> wrote:
> >
> > Alan, it's never too late to start. I didn't start flying until age 40 (mid-life crisis), and now have been flying for over 26 years. I started flying R/C models and it progressed to ordering a Kolb Firestar kit in 1986. I had never built anything before, except airplane models, so it was a challenge. Needless to say, that Firestar kit has been flying all this time. Five years ago I bought a Kolb Kolbra. I'm the guy that produced the "Rushford fly-in" video. I went and got my Sport license to fly it and it has been a dream come true. I absolutely love flying especially when I can share it with friends and family. My advice is to pursue your dream and you will never regret it.
> >
> > Ralph Burlingame
> > Kolb Kolbra
>

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

That is what I was thinking.

Thanks

From: Richard Bauer <rk911@yahoo.com>
To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 8:18 PM
Subject: RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

no, all you need is a government issued photo ID, preferably a driver's license. no medical certificate is needed. good luck!

'73,
rich, n9dko
Never buy an urn at an estate sale. Just trust me on this.

_________________________________

From: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Herman Funk
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 5:52 PM
To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Hello Alan,
Your post is indeed encouraging. I am turning 70 in a couple of months and have been wondering if I was off my rocker considering learning to fly as a Sport Pilot. You and your wife sound just like me and mine. With the limited time we have spent with friends in small planes I think Sport Pilot and LSA' are exactly what we would greatly enjoy.

My big challenge is finding a CFI and plane to get training. I have been strongly considering purchasing something like a Aeronca Champ, if I could find one at an affordable price and relatively close to where I live in NW Missouri.

Thanks for the suggestions about taking it a step at a time, sort of like eating an elephant. Does one need a student license to start training for Sport Pilot?

Herman

From: circicirci <acensor@fastmail.fm>
To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 11:12 AM
Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Alan,

Adding to, agreeing with, and echoing Ralph's "you're never to old" comment:

Although I did briefly fly a hang glider in the 70's, and bummed a very few hours at the controls when I could beg a fight or pay for a sightseeing flight, I didin't start seriously into getting my license until age 70. Was flying solo before my 71st birth day an have been having a blast since. My wife loves to fly .

Another note of a mental and training strategy that worked well for me, and might for others: to avoid getting overwhelmed or discouraged or procrastinate on "all these skills, tests, requirements" Was so to speak compartmentalised and bite the requirements off sort of one at a time. Kind of like this:

First, get student license.
Get some dual time and some comfort flying.
Get to where CFI let's me land.
Get signed off to solo.

Practice/study knowledge test to point where I can consistently score not less than 80% on the computerized practice tests.
Get my test software to generate its authorization for me to take FAA test certificate.
Schedule an official FAA test.

Get signed off for required cross counrty flight.and do it.

Learn and prep for what to expect on final flight exam with DPE.
Find out as much as practical about what tat particular flight examiner expects and does.
Schedule final flight exam.
Take and pass it.
Make sure to get all useful endorsements from CFI.. Particularly controlled airspace endorsement.

Scheduling test points, very useful. Knowing, for example, my knowledge test was in two weeks really got me disciplined about polishing my studying. Got 98% on the test. I don't kid myself that tha means "I have mastery of 98% of all weather, aeronautics,navigation, FAA rules,etc. " I had a bit of good luck in what questions popped up on my particular test session ... But I kew form my practice tests there was no way I could get less than 80% rock bottom.
What a relief to have each step done.

--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, "Ralph" <rstar447@...> wrote:
>
> Alan, it's never too late to start. I didn't start flying until age 40 (mid-life crisis), and now have been flying for over 26 years. I started flying R/C models and it progressed to ordering a Kolb Firestar kit in 1986. I had never built anything before, except airplane models, so it was a challenge. Needless to say, that Firestar kit has been flying all this time. Five years ago I bought a Kolb Kolbra. I'm the guy that produced the "Rushford fly-in" video. I went and got my Sport license to fly it and it has been a dream come true. I absolutely love flying especially when I can share it with friends and family. My advice is to pursue your dream and you will never regret it.
>
> Ralph Burlingame
> Kolb Kolbra

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Sunday, July 28, 2013

RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

no, all you need is a government issued photo ID, preferably a driver's license. no medical certificate is needed. good luck!

'73,
rich, n9dko
Never buy an urn at an estate sale. Just trust me on this.

_________________________________

From: circicirci <acensor@fastmail.fm>
To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 11:12 AM
Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

From: circicirci <acensor@fastmail.fm>
To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 11:12 AM
Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Sure wish Sport Pilot had existed when I learned to fly. No regrets though. It makes transitioning from Private to Sport Pilot much simpler. Sport Pilot is tailor made for people like me who just want to go up for an hour or two with a friend and enjoy the scenery, or take a short jaunt. No IFR and no night flying (don't see all that well after dark anymore). I can repair my own ELSA and sign the logs. I took the ELSA Repairman 16 hour course five yeas ago. I say, and I'm sure many others will agree, it doesn't get any better than this.

Norm

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Saturday, July 27, 2013

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Norman- there is a Flight Design CT at Hillsdale

Tom

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 27, 2013, at 11:29 AM, "Norman" <nedavis49015@yahoo.com> wrote:

Sounds like a plan to me. Start at square one. Don't let the interest go. You will live to regret it. Never stop dreaming.

Now, I have a question: Does anyone out there know an LSA instructor with an aircraft in Kalamazoo/Battle Creek, MI area? I am in need of a BFR. Last instructor I knew who had any time has moved away.

Norm
--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" <abartz@...> wrote:
>
> Hello everyone. This is my starting point in my adventure towards LSA activity. I have reached the point in my life that either I start this interest now, or let it go. I choose to start!
>
> I know only what I have read in the WIKI sites regarding obtaining a LSA certificate. It seems doable for me. There is an airfield close by and will also be lurking around there to get an idea of how to proceed.
>
> The goal is to own and fly a piper type aircraft. I am very impressed by the Graphite Cub I found at CubCrafters. Most every review I have found liked them too.
>
> So here I am, ready to learn. Hit me with your best advise, or warnings. Hopefully I will be able to contribute something down the road.
>
> Thanks for having me here!
>
> Alan
> Southern California
>

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Hi Alan,

Welcome to the group. I hope your dreams come true.

I offer the following advice:

1. Set aside the taildragger (Cub) dream in favor of a conventional/tricycle gear plane for now. This will greatly simplify and speed up your training.

2. Find out where your local EAA club meets and attend some meetings. Get to know local EAA members and get some rides in different planes.

3. Find out where the nearest flying clubs are and investigate membership. Learning to fly in a club is going to be much cheaper than at the local flying school. If you can afford the rates at an for-profit flying school, all the better. We're talking about a savings of 50% here.

4. When you find an instructor that you like, keep him/her. If the chemistry is not right with an instructor, get another one.

Keep us posted on your journey to becoming a Sport Pilot, Private Pilot, Commercial Pilot, ATP . . . .

Fly safely,

Dennis

Skycatcher Page http://users.foxvalley.net/~dpersyk/skycatcher.htm

--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, "Alan" wrote:
>
> Hello everyone. This is my starting point in my adventure towards LSA activity. I have reached the point in my life that either I start this interest now, or let it go. I choose to start!
>
> I know only what I have read in the WIKI sites regarding obtaining a LSA certificate. It seems doable for me. There is an airfield close by and will also be lurking around there to get an idea of how to proceed.
>
> The goal is to own and fly a piper type aircraft. I am very impressed by the Graphite Cub I found at CubCrafters. Most every review I have found liked them too.
>
> So here I am, ready to learn. Hit me with your best advise, or warnings. Hopefully I will be able to contribute something down the road.
>
> Thanks for having me here!
>
> Alan
> Southern California
>

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

I guess you mean getting your Sport Pilot License when you say "LSA certificate."

I got my sport pilot license about two years ago and have over 250 hours logged time on a LSA I own with a partner.

I'm very happy with my sport pilot training and license and love flying and love my LSA aircraft.

I think I'm an exception. Other than the many ultralight pilots who transitioned into Sport Pilot certification,

in truth very few people have gotten into flying by directly getting a sport pilot license.

A couple of notes:

1) Be sure that there's near you either a flying club or an aircraft rental that HAS a sport pilot legal aircraft for you to fly.

Otherwise, unless you buy your own aircraft, you'll have a Sport Pilot certification that cost you much time and money and find ti useless.

Many aircraft rental places do not have a single Sport Pilot legal LSA for rent.

1b) I ran into one place in the San Diego area (you mentioned you're from there) that has a nice Sport Pilot legal LSA (Skycatcher) for rent, but even though a sport pilot license entitles you to fly it as far as FAA is concerned, they (because of their insurer) require that you have a current valid medical certificate also. Note that many people get sport pilot licenses precisely because they either don't want to take the medical exam or are afraid they might not pass it. Once you fail a medical exam or withdraw the application you can no longer fly with a sport pilot license. Watch out for this, it could in a worst case result in a disaster for you if you got involved with such a FBO rental under your Sport Pilot license.

2) Figure realistically (if you don't own your own LSA, or don't have access to a flying club that will let you train in their sport pilot legal aircraft) that it will cost you around $4000 by the time you're licensed. And figure about 35 hours.

Yes, it is true some people have managed to do it in 20 or 25 hours of flying (not counting their study time for the written test) and for less cash, but don't count on it.

3) Learning to fly (be it sport pilot or regular private pilot) with flying sessions spread too far apart is very inefficient.

For example, if you only get up for two or three hours once a month. Many people who try to do it that way never finish. You lose too much "currency" between training sessions. Being able to go up IMO at least once a week for three hours is minimum viable training interval. Ideally you'd IMO go up for 2 hours every second day, and study 1 or two hours the day in between.

3b) Some CFIs and flight schools that specialize in sport pilot training offer intensive training concentrated in a small period of time, such as two weeks or 10 days in one block of time. If you can afford the time and money and housing and transportation to such a location/operation it could be a good way to get it all done. Some of them require that BEFORE you show up you take and pass the FAA knowledge test (sometime called the "written test" even though it's all computerized these days.)

4) 70% of all people who start out to get their pilot's license never finish. Most common reasons IMO are it's costing more than they expected, and they are unable or unwilling to stay current and train with short intervals between sessions. Less likely, though possible, they find the knowledge test type learning, or even the flying skill itself, too challenging. I'd suggest you go take some of the many free on-the-web sample sport pilot FAA knowledge tests. Of course you shouldn't expect to do well on those (I'm assuming you don't have a lot of prior flight book learning) but they should give you a feel of what type of "book learning" .. intellectual knowledge and skill.. you'll be dealing with in the ground-type-learning involved with Sport Pilot. If your reaction to that is "I sort of understand that stuff" and/or "sure I could learn that stuff and maybe even enjoy learning it" then good. On the other hand if your reaction is "WTF are they TALKING about" and/or "I hate learning that sort of stuff" then maybe you should either back off your flying plans OR make a point of get a good tutorial (there are many free, some cheap, many very expensive on disk or online) for learning this knowledge test stuff and see if you can get a handle the knowledge test BEFORE spending a lot of time and money learning to fly the plane and then get stopped at the knowledge test level. If you take and pass the test it's good for two years.

The amount of material you are SUPPOSEDLY supposed to completely master can seem intimidating (meteorology, aerodynamics, aviation law, mechanics, aircraft performance calculations, navigation, etc., etc.) But remember, thousands of student pilots pass those tests and you only have to pass with 70%. (When I took sample tests BEFORE I started any formal flight training or software tutorials I was scoring 50 to 65% or even sometimes 70%; I was an experienced model plane builder, physics student, etc., so I had a leg up on that stuff. Point is, how easy or challenging you'll find the knowledge learning depends in part what sort of background and knowledge you arrive at the table with.)

5) As for aircraft: You'll find a wide range of strong opinions, many of them knowledgeable, on what's a suitable aircraft for a sport pilot.

The Graphite Cub (Carbon Cub SS) has some wonderful characteristics; I ASSUME you have what by my standards is a pretty fat wallet or you wouldn't even be looking at a Carbon Cub. (Were you aware that a used half decently equip Carbon Cub will set you back $150,000 or more?)

There are many many LSA's at significantly lower prices that are IMO wonderful light sport aircraft.... some, in my opinion, with advantages over the Carbon Cub. Even ignoring price (which few of us can) what is the "best" aircraft for you depends on what and how you will use it? Is ability to land on fields outside airports (back country flying) important? Is cruise speed really important? Luggage capacity? Visibility (high wings are generally better for visibility downward)? Ability to stay aloft for a long period of time with low fuel consumption? Range? Cabin comfort? Ease of maintenance? Maintenance costs? Availability of mechanics familiar with your type of plane? And the all important "handling characteristics"?

5b) If buying an aircraft, get really familiar with the difference in maintenance rules for "experimental" and standard category LSAs.

In short, generally speaking, owning a standard category LSA will cost you a lot more in, and be a lot more restricted in,maintenance.

6) To quote a friend who is an aircraft mechanic when I was consulting with him on what sort of plane to buy:

"An aircraft can cost you more money in more ways than I can name."

7) My personal opinion is that if you can afford it, and have some knowledge (or can get some knowledge) of how to purchase a plane, it's best to get your plane first and train in your own aircraft. You will safe significant money in aircraft rental during your dual training and solo practice times, and when finally have your license, don't have to learn a different type of plane than the one you trained in.

8) If this is a dream of yours don't put it off too long. It's not going to get any cheaper or easier to get licensed as the years go by.

9) Study the limitations of the sport pilot license compared to the regular private pilot license.

Sport pilot IS a bit easier and cheaper to get.

For me the only limitation that is at all annoying is that I can never fly any aircraft that can carry more than one passenger .... never can take my wife AND a guest or friend up at the same time. Similarly it rules out my owning (if I want to fly them) a whole lot of very nice not terribly expensive aircraft that don't fit under the LSA definition.

My two cents.

Hope it helps.

Alex

Alan wrote IN PART ---

>Fri Jul 26, 2013 11:34 am (PDT) . Posted by: "Alan" alan_wendy Hello everyone. This is my starting point in my adventure towards LSA activity. I have reached the point in my life that either I start this interest now, or let it go. I choose to start!

I know only what I have read in the WIKI sites regarding obtaining a LSA certificate. It seems doable for me. There is an airfield close by and will also be lurking around there to get an idea of how to proceed.

The goal is to own and fly a piper type aircraft. I am very impressed by the Graphite Cub I found at CubCrafters. Most every review I have found liked them too.

So here I am, ready to learn. Hit me with your best advise, or warnings.<

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Fellow Skycatcher Owners/Renters/Interested Parties

Hi Group,

I'd like to trade flying and maintenance issues off line with other Skycatcher enthusiasts. I'm based at 68IS in North Central Illinois.

Click on my name to send me an email.

Here's some photos of my Skycatcher. In a couple of days the N-number will become N900DP. The paperwork required to assign a custom N-number is outrageous!

http://users.foxvalley.net/~dpersyk/skycatcher.htm

Fly safely,
Dennis

------------------------------------

Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/

<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional

<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Sport_Aircraft/join
(Yahoo! ID required)

<*> To change settings via email:
Sport_Aircraft-digest@yahoogroups.com
Sport_Aircraft-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
Sport_Aircraft-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: I need help

Hi Group,

I'm curious about your comment about Skycatcher climb rate. My Skycatcher climbs at about 700 fps at full gross on a day 15 to 20 F degrees above standard atmosphere. This is at about 70 kias, well below Vy, as I find the deck angle at Vy to be very restrictive of forward vision. For the record, that is much better climb performance than my Skyhawk Model K had at full gross.

What LSAs have better actual climb rates?

Fly safely,

Dennis

--- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, "vardonx" wrote:
>
> Yup I goofed and meant max takeoff weight. I disagree that most lsa's cant't actually fly near that weight...the Remos GX flys fine at 1250 lbs in the nice FL sunshine
>
> --- In Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com, Garygaryo@ wrote:
> >
> > Correction. 1320 is max takeoff weight, and not useful load of LSA. Most all will climb at 1,000 ft per minute or better loaded to that limit regardless of the rated useful loads. There are exceptions, like the SkyCatcher.
> >
> > Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4GLTE Phone
> >
> > -----Original message-----
> > From: "A. Censor" acensor@
> > To: Sport_Aircraft@yahoogroups.com
> > Sent: Wed, Apr 25, 2012 14:52:21 GMT+00:00
> > Subject: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: I need help
> >
> > "vardonx" catalina1783@ vardonx
> > ON Tue Apr 24, 2012 8:23 am (PDT) WROTE, IN PART ---
> > >From a useful load perspective it sounds like either the Jabiru J230 or a Kitfox would possibly work, since I believe both were originally spec'd at over 1320 lbs useful load....... <
> >
> > Hi Vardonx,
> >
> > That â€œ1320â€ you quote isnâ€™t what you present it as.
> > It is not the â€œuseful loadâ€ --- it is not even the maximum takeoff weight.
> >
> >
> > If you put 1320 pounds either of those aircraft youâ€™d probably never get off the runway and if you did manage to get off into ground effect youâ€™d be in big trouble.
> >
> > What it that 1320 IS is the â€œMaximum Gross Takeoff Weightâ€ set by regulation for ANY aircraft to be sport pilot legal.
> > See http://www.sportpilot.org/learn/final_rule_synopsis.html
> >
> > There is one version of the Jabiru J230 that has a useable load of 792 lbs but that one is NOT an LSA... not legal for a sport pilot.
> >
> >
> > The reported useable load for the highest performance version of the LSA Kitfox (with the 100hp Rotax engine) is 552 pounds.
> > Thatâ€™s less than my Skyrangerâ€™s useful load, and unsuitable (even if he/she fit in there) for a 450 pounder to fly in as that would leave about 100 pounds for the instructor plus fuel.
> > I doubt youâ€™ll find any LSA with a useful load of more than about 650 pounds.
> > And as others have pointed out itâ€™s not great, even if you can fit in there, to be flying right near those limits.
> >
> > Alex
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Alex
> >
>

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

All About Light Sport Aircraft

Wednesday, July 31, 2013

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point - update

RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Tuesday, July 30, 2013

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group MAP

Monday, July 29, 2013

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Sunday, July 28, 2013

RE: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Saturday, July 27, 2013

Re: Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: A starting point

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Fellow Skycatcher Owners/Renters/Interested Parties

Light-Sport Aircraft Yahoo group Re: I need help

Followers

Blog Archive

About Me